Gausman still could be the fifth starter right away

[scOtt]

This is self-evident.

I like the discussion about how hard the old timers threw compared to now... one factor I don't see mentioned, though, is that pitchers threw many, many, many more pitches back in Johnson's and Feller's day. That may be even more important than advancements in athleticism/training in accounting for speed increasing. I mean, let's say that WJ and BF could indeed throw 100mph. How many times could they do it if they had to toss 150 times every 4 days as opposed to 100 times every 5 days?

Also back then they were not expected to throw at max effort. They only reared back at critical points in the game.

[Can_of_corn]

Also back then they were not expected to throw at max effort. They only reared back at critical points in the game.

I am guessing a 17 year old Feller was rearing back with regularity.

[scOtt]

I am guessing a 17 year old Feller was rearing back with regularity.

I meant Johnson and Woods era.

[Can_of_corn]

I meant Johnson and Woods era.

Feller's too just not as much. I just don't think telling a 17 year old to throttle back when pitching to major leagers would have accomplished much.

[scOtt]

Feller's too just not as much. I just don't think telling a 17 year old to throttle back when pitching to major leagers would have accomplished much.

Probably not.

[tntoriole]

"The first time I faced Walter Johnson, I watched him take that easy windup. And then something went past me that made me flinch. The thing just hissed with danger. We couldn't touch him. ... every one of us knew we'd met the most powerful arm ever turned loose in a ball park." Ty Cobb, 1907

It was probably both a combination of the angle and the speed. A Connecticut munitions factory in 1917 unofficially measured Johnson's fastball at about 92 mph, but who really knows. What we do know is that the hitters of the time could not hit him, at all. That he was the most dominating pitcher of his time, so there was something about his pitch that was distinctly more effective than anyone of his era.

[scOtt]

"The first time I faced Walter Johnson, I watched him take that easy windup. And then something went past me that made me flinch. The thing just hissed with danger. We couldn't touch him. ... every one of us knew we'd met the most powerful arm ever turned loose in a ball park." Ty Cobb, 1907

It was probably both a combination of the angle and the speed. A Connecticut munitions factory in 1917 unofficially measured Johnson's fastball at about 92 mph, but who really knows. What we do know is that the hitters of the time could not hit him, at all. That he was the most dominating pitcher of his time, so there was something about his pitch that was distinctly more effective than anyone of his era.

You have to figure that back then "only" 92 WAS like 100 nowadays. NObody threw that hard. It's all relative to the era.

[Can_of_corn]

You have to figure that back then "only" 92 WAS like 100 nowadays. NObody threw that hard. It's all relative to the era.

That and he was big for his era and with that delivery the ball would have got on em quick.

[Stotle]

That and he was big for his era and with that delivery the ball would have got on em quick.

And heavier bats.

[Frobby]

Famously as Johnson aged he could no longer pitch as deep into games. The first "closer" was a converted starter whose main job was to finish Johnson's starts.

It's interesting to look at Johnson's stats. At first glance, it seems like had two careers, one from ages 19-31 (297-191, 1.65 ERA, 5.8 K/9), and another from ages 32-39 (120-88, 3.33 ERA, 4.4 K/9). In reality, the drastic increase in his ERA and drop in his K rate reflects the changing nature of the game in that period. The league-wide K rate went from 4.2 K/9 in 1910 to 2.7 in 1924, and the league wide ERA went from 2.39 in 1908 to 5.19 in 1925. The big turning point in Johnson's stats came in 1920, at the same time that the league ERA jumped by 0.57 runs/game in a single season.

In any event, despite his reputation as a strikeout artist, his K rates were about half of what a strikeout pitcher would do in today's game, and that calls into question whether he really was throwing anywhere near the high 90's.